Topic: Enter the Clay Warrior King : Domination Redefined / 7 RG Titles and Counting

[monstertruck]

No hat hanging here, just the facts.

Should be interesting to see what, if any adjustments Nadal makes in his match up with Nole.  As I've mentioned before, against Nole and the other time-stealers, I think Nadal has to find a way to be the first to seize the initiative.  Improving his serve and making it a weapon would do just that.  Not necessarily more pace, but solidifying the first serve as a weapon and improving depth and placement on the 2nd.  How many times did we just watch him roll the 2nd serve into the middle against Nole???  It was tough to watch, even for a non-fanboy like myself.

Improvements on the ROS as well might go a long ways towards giving Raf the initial edge in a point.

That being said, both those tactics are contrary to his strategy and mindset.  "I thump da Ball!"

[Start da Game]

I agree with Falc. If Rafa could def. Novak once things might turn around for him. I'm sure he is working hard. I do think that he should get rid of his uncle Toni and hire a real trainer who will be able to give him some new perspective. Rafa needs some sort of change in his life in order to improve and move on.

One win would not erase the last several loses and the fact that Nole's game pushes Nadal back on his heels.  It might boost his confidence a little, but one win for Fed over Nadal would not change much either.  Just the way it goes.  But with that said, I don't believe Nadal has been at his best this year, but I think Nole has a way of making a player look off of their game.

Ain't it funny how the two are related?

Yup.  Nadal does it to Federer.  Nole does it to everyone, but it seems to affect Nadal a good deal.  Maybe because Nadal just never looks like he is on his heels and is usually dictating more play.

it's not like nadal never dominated djokovic, unlike fed in the case of nadal......

[Tennis4you]

its funny how some folks continue to hang their hats on 2011. a very big mistake as far as i am concerned. he will break down nole on clay next year or anybody else that gets in his way on his turf.
 
2012 is another year. he fixes his fitness and his serve and the story will change.
 
also as i have suggested. i fully expect the clay warrior to take care of his turf next year.
 
madrid can be lost again but he is not going to give an inch of real estate at monte carlo, rome, and RG. that should set the table for the rest of his year.

I really wish we could have seen Nole and Nadal face off at the FO in 2011.

And not hanging our hats on any year, but it is still indeed 2011 yo. 

[hercules]

mighty general scot bakerstein you just might get you wish and you are not going to like it. nadal will demolish nole at RG.
 for further clarification, check nadal`s record in best of 5 sets matches on the red clay for the last 7 years.
its his personal turf.


and that is if the great serbian slayer makes it to the final.

bottom line: say hello to RG #7 in 2012.

[Tennis4you]

mighty general scot bakerstein you just might get you wish and you are not going to like it. nadal will demolish nole at RG.
 for further clarification, check nadal`s record in best of 5 sets matches on the red clay for the last 7 years.
its his personal turf.


and that is if the great serbian slayer makes it to the final.

bottom line: say hello to RG #7 in 2012.

Didn't say the preferred outcome, I was just looking for sweet tennis!

[Alex]

mighty general scot bakerstein you just might get you wish and you are not going to like it. nadal will demolish nole at RG.
 for further clarification, check nadal`s record in best of 5 sets matches on the red clay for the last 7 years.
its his personal turf.


and that is if the great serbian slayer makes it to the final.

bottom line: say hello to RG #7 in 2012.

Herc, I don't think that Nadal would demolish Nole even in Paris. I think it would be a close match.  OK, I'm aware of Rafa's record on clay but still... 'destroying' is a tough word. It's not going to happen. Novak can play very well on clay.

[Tennis4you]

mighty general scot bakerstein you just might get you wish and you are not going to like it. nadal will demolish nole at RG.
 for further clarification, check nadal`s record in best of 5 sets matches on the red clay for the last 7 years.
its his personal turf.


and that is if the great serbian slayer makes it to the final.

bottom line: say hello to RG #7 in 2012.

Herc, I don't think that Nadal would demolish Nole even in Paris. I think it would be a close match.  OK, I'm aware of Rafa's record on clay but still... 'destroying' is a tough word. It's not going to happen. Novak can play very well on clay.

He knows.    Nadal lost 6 times to Nole this year and twice on clay.  Probably not going to "destroy" anyone with that kind of record.

[monstertruck]

mighty general scot bakerstein you just might get you wish and you are not going to like it. nadal will demolish nole at RG.
 for further clarification, check nadal`s record in best of 5 sets matches on the red clay for the last 7 years.
its his personal turf.


and that is if the great serbian slayer makes it to the final.

bottom line: say hello to RG #7 in 2012.

Herc, I don't think that Nadal would demolish Nole even in Paris. I think it would be a close match.  OK, I'm aware of Rafa's record on clay but still... 'destroying' is a tough word. It's not going to happen. Novak can play very well on clay.

He knows.    Nadal lost 6 times to Nole this year and twice on clay.  Probably not going to "destroy" anyone with that kind of record.

Fangirls see and say what they want regardless of the facts.
Who knows, perhaps Raf will have the anwers this year and he will only drop a couple of matches.

For true fans of the game, it's not about the players so much as it is about the quality of tennis.

[hercules]

ok lets try to come with the possible score. you know i have to stick with his record in the finals at RG.
 
i say 4 relatively close sets if they battle it out in the final there.
 
i am watching nadal against fish now. he still stinks on hard courts. hits too short, returns poorly, and his shots still lack the bite.
 
nole will kill him on hard courts unless he fixes a few things.
 
so for this reason  i expect the clay warrior to be really determined to protect his turf in 2012.

[hercules]

get the facts straight monster man. you keep paying this huge lip service to  the facts but your facts look more like prayers:
 
1. he is 6-0 in the finals at RG.
2. he has lost just 1 best of 5 sets match on red clay in his entire life.
3. nadal has defeated nole 16 times and often in very important matches so he is not going to just go away. he will try to dig deep again.
 
this year is over. it was nole`e year and we have to congratulate him. nole was able to lift himself and the sport.
 
going by the facts and the record which is sheer objective probability, nobody who understands the game is going to bet against nadal at RG.
 
and what is this "fangirls" garbage? you just cant help yourself, can you?
 
you cant have much of a forum here with just a few posters clown so i suggest you start receiving people with open arms. keep your garbage in check.

[monstertruck]

Unlike you, the only thing I would consider praying for is excellent tennis and quality posts from courteous members.

I fully hope/expect that Nadal rises to the challenge that Nole has put before him.  A possible RG final scoreline might read something like this- 
3-6, 6-4, 6-4, 6-3.

But of course we know that only you and Shankar can foresee the future!

[hercules]

this should clear it all once and for all folks:
 
nadal is just bringing horrible tennis to the party time and again. no wonder now even murray destroyed him.
 
he took 11 of last 12 games. just horrible tennis.
 
you already know part of the problem: its the mechanics of those heavy topspin strokes. it takes too long for him to execute his options and he doesnt get that time on quick hard courts.
 
the other problem is that usually his speed and his fitness is good enough for most. now there is a slight drop in his speed and his movement and of course he let his fitness slip after 2010.
 
and you are seeing the results. now he has lost 7 finals if i am not mistaken. he would have taken at least 5 of them in the past.
 
so its him more than them. he is the one who is bringing terrible tennis to the party. now add hard courts to the equation and you can see why he is struggling.
 
lack of significant improvements in his game have allowed the field to catch up with him. only he can fix his issues.

[monstertruck]

Do you see him altering his strokes in any way to give himself more time?

Perhaps the fitness can be brought back up to snuff if indeed there is any issue there.

The only other alternative is to stick to the clay.
That would be trrrrbl for the game.

[hercules]

Do you see him altering his strokes in any way to give himself more time?

Perhaps the fitness can be brought back up to snuff if indeed there is any issue there.

The only other alternative is to stick to the clay.
That would be trrrrbl for the game.

he is hopeless on quick hard courts man. i think i will stop being pissed off at him for a little while anyway. i dont cut him much slack anyway usually.

still no excuse for loss of speed, diminished footwork, and a significant drop in fitness. he just turned 25.

and you are right. i have been saying this for 1000 years now: clay is the wellspring from which he flows.

he needs to practice year around on clay to keep his strokes sharp. he is losing the only thing he had going for him which was machine like consistency.

and he needs to get going during the off season fast with his fitness and his training.

we really need to marvel at this now: how the hell was he able to snatch 2 slams on hard courts. that is one hell of an achievement for him. and they were against 2 of the greatest hard court players around.

[Alex]

Herc, you are too harsh when it comes to Rafa. OK, he lost to Murray. I don't want to underestimate Andy's win but it's a 500 tourny.  Nadal is a very good HC player in my honest opinion. The guy won both USO and AO. That is huge. I do think that his body is getting tired. It's the way he plays. What do you do? I was talking about Fed previously, I don't think that either one can change anything in their game.

[hercules]

i am the toughest and the harshest on my players general alex.

[Alex]

i am the toughest and the harshest on my players general alex.

I know. It's cool. I like passionate people 

[fan]

Saying Nadal isn't a great hard court player is foolish. Wining against Federer in 2004 and taking him to 5 sets in 2005, both HC.

Two Slams (AO and USO), one more final (USO), WTF Finals, 5 Masters 1000.

He reached 4 HC Finals this year alone, unfortunately didn't win one, but why the hell would his wins on hard be surprising. Just because he's superior on clay doesn't mean he's not great on HC too.


My expectations for next year are at least 1 Slam, at least 2 Masters and 1 or 2 smaller tournaments (Doha or Tokyo or Barcelona). I'm hoping he continues the tradition of winning the preparation tournament in Abu Dhabi for confidence boost. I want him to be completely fit in Australia once again. I'd like him to win Monte Carlo for 8th time in a row and get at least Rome or Madrid back. But most of all (if it doesn't happen this year) I'd like him to go one step further in World Tour Finals. That is the last thing missing from his collection of trophies.

Oh yeah I forgot. And an Olympic gold please.        

[Alex]

Saying Nad al isn't a great hard courtplayer is foolish. Wining against Federer in 2004 and taking him to 5 sets in 2005, both HC.

Two Slams (AO and USO), one more final (USO), WTF Finals, 5 Masters 1000.

He reached 4 HC Finals this year alone, unfortunately didn't win one, but why the hell would his wins on hard be surprising. Just because he's superior on clay doesn't mean he's not great on HC too.


My expectations for next year are at least 1 Slam, at least 2 Masters and 1 or 2 smaller tournaments (Doha or Tokyo or Barcelona). I'm hoping he continues the tradition of winning the preparation tournament in Abu Dhabi for confidence boost. I want him to be completely fit in Australia once again. I'd like him to win Monte Carlo for 8th time in a row and get at least Rome or Madrid back. But most of all (if it doesn't happen this year) I'd like him to go one step further in World Tour Finals. That is the last thing missing from his collection of trophies.

Oh yeah I forgot. And an Olympic gold please.        

oK, I lost ya here. Who said that Nadal was not a great HC player?

[fan]

It has been alluded to quite often on this forum. Are you blind?

And if someone is surprised how the hell could Nadal snatch two HC Slams, I understand it as an implication he doesn't consider Nadal a top HC player.