Author Topic: Roger Federer? Hes not the best of all time. He would have lost tp McEnroe/Borg  (Read 3165 times)

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Offline Dallas

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Technology and training improvements have not just changed tennis...it plays a part in all sports.  That's why times have increased (look at swimming, track/field, etc.).  When you look at tennis in the past vs tennis now -- the sport doesn't even look the same.   Anyway, Becker changes his vote on things all the time.  He's just one person.  You can either agree or not agree with him.  It's Becker's  opinion and he has a right to his opinion - doesn't mean everyone has to agree or disagree with him.

Offline Alex

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Boris does have some good points, but at the end it's how much you win, like any other sport. The problem in tennis is that, and God knows how many times we talked about this, it is almost impossible to compare different eras. When I started watching tennis, as a kid, Borg was my idol and I still think he is the best one.  he quit when he was only 25yo.

If you look at tennis history, we have Laver, we have so many 'old' players who were playing tennis and winning for 20 years or so at that time. I wasn't able to watch those players except for some odd you tube videos. people have a short memory.

then, the open era, pre open era. it gets too complicated. just my 5 cents.
« Last Edit: November 06, 2012, 03:33:34 PM by Alex »

Offline jesse james

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i've said it before, but you simply can't compare guys from different eras, it's fun-but that's all.
Different technology means a different mindset too. It would be just as absurd to ask if McEnroe could beat Fed at Wimbledon now.
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Offline Alex

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i've said it before, but you simply can't compare guys from different eras, it's fun-but that's all.
Different technology means a different mindset too. It would be just as absurd to ask if McEnroe could beat Fed at Wimbledon now.
well, exactly. we average tennis fans can BS about this 24/7 and get nowhere. Boris does know a little bit more about tennis than us. He is not denying that Roger is one of the best ones, he is just saying the fact that everything is different nowadays then before and he is right.

of course, Lady Dallas and FFF will disagree and torture us with Fed again  :rofl_2:. oops had to poke someone tonight. you 2 should be honored  :))

Offline jesse james

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i've said it before, but you simply can't compare guys from different eras, it's fun-but that's all.
Different technology means a different mindset too. It would be just as absurd to ask if McEnroe could beat Fed at Wimbledon now.
well, exactly. we average tennis fans can BS about this 24/7 and get nowhere. Boris does know a little bit more about tennis than us. He is not denying that Roger is one of the best ones, he is just saying the fact that everything is different nowadays then before and he is right.

of course, Lady Dallas and FFF will disagree and torture us with Fed again  :rofl_2:. oops had to poke someone tonight. you 2 should be honored  :))

Boris may know more about tennis than us in one sense, but that doesn't make his views more cogent.
Professional tennis players would have different views on this anyway, and i've no reason to believe that the degree of coherence they might employ in their arguments correlates to their success as a player. Unless you're a hapless devote of some kind of inverted ad hominemism, why would you want to privilege the arguments of current or former professional players?
I am a lighthouse worn by the weather and the waves
And though I'm empty I still warn the sailors on their way

Offline mav140

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Good article... But it goes both ways... And as everyone here says, you can't compare eras... And as I said, it goes both ways... Becker wants to know how Roger would adapt to a wooden raquet,.. I would also want to know how McEnroe or Borg would adapt in real competitive tennis with today's technology or how much would they last in today's demanding schedule, body and type of tennis... Or if Connor would win a GS at 39 in today's tennis.. I mean it goes both ways and unfortunately there is no way of knowing any of these...

Besides, Becker always tend to change his mind about this specific issue.. So, I could link dozens of articles praising Fed as the best of all times and another dozen "diminishing". Fed's achievements.. You never know with Boris..

And of course it still remains he has to protect his era just as anybody would... I mean, we are just fans of A player and even us are defending eras because of our favorite player...

My 2 cents

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Offline Alex

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Jessy, it's because all journalists are like ... they need to find some truth and everything is so questionable. They need to write about something. Who is the biggest, who is the bestest sort of thing. Boris was maybe politically correct.   What I learned at the University is this. Give me  exact parameters  I'll do exact measurements for you

. How do you do that in tennis?  again different equipment, different surfaces ... everything different. i.e. Laver won all of his slams on grass and clay. So how do you compare Laver with Fed? impossible.

I read too many books about old players and tennis history so I hope you understand. I might elaborate more on this later, just trying to type and working on some stupid work  project here, fighting with this stupid cold. sorry for typos.

If we take slams as the only parameter, yes Fed is the best. If we talk about the numbers of tournaments won, nobody even comes close to Connors. it's all relative. If we talk about fame, I think it's Borg.





« Last Edit: November 06, 2012, 05:27:29 PM by Alex »

Offline Alex

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Good article... But it goes both ways... And as everyone here says, you can't compare eras... And as I said, it goes both ways... Becker wants to know how Roger would adapt to a wooden raquet,.. I would also want to know how McEnroe or Borg would adapt in real competitive tennis with today's technology or how much would they last in today's demanding schedule, body and type of tennis... Or if Connor would win a GS at 39 in today's tennis.. I mean it goes both ways and unfortunately there is no way of knowing any of these...

Besides, Becker always tend to change his mind about this specific issue.. So, I could link dozens of articles praising Fed as the best of all times and another dozen "diminishing". Fed's achievements.. You never know with Boris..

And of course it still remains he has to protect his era just as anybody would... I mean, we are just fans of A player and even us are defending eras because of our favorite player...

My 2 cents

Sent from my LG-P990 using Tapatalk 2
Mav, this is a great point and what I was talking about. love your post. how do you judge? who will adopt how? give a wooden racquet to Djokovic or Fed and watch them play  :)).  Bring young JMac and Borg in their prime, and give them modern racquets, speed up Wimbledon grass, put them against Fed or Sampras and let's see what happens.  I think it would be hilarious. all players in their prime  :)>>>>

Offline williamchung7

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Old stuff, nothing new.

Offline Start da Game

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clearly boris knows 1000 times more than what we know.......
Marian Vajda to Novak Djokovic, "I saw you beat that man like I never saw no man get beat before, and the man KEPT COMING AFTER YOU! Now we don't need no man like that in our lives."

i demand french open to be renamed RAFAEL GARROS

Offline mav140

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clearly boris knows 1000 times more than what we know.......

And clearly Agassi, Wilander, McEnroe even Borg know more than we do... that hasn't stop them to proclaim Fed as the best... So, does that mean they have come up with a scientific fact that Fed is the best or even worse than they? NO....

Offline mav140

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Good article... But it goes both ways... And as everyone here says, you can't compare eras... And as I said, it goes both ways... Becker wants to know how Roger would adapt to a wooden raquet,.. I would also want to know how McEnroe or Borg would adapt in real competitive tennis with today's technology or how much would they last in today's demanding schedule, body and type of tennis... Or if Connor would win a GS at 39 in today's tennis.. I mean it goes both ways and unfortunately there is no way of knowing any of these...

Besides, Becker always tend to change his mind about this specific issue.. So, I could link dozens of articles praising Fed as the best of all times and another dozen "diminishing". Fed's achievements.. You never know with Boris..

And of course it still remains he has to protect his era just as anybody would... I mean, we are just fans of A player and even us are defending eras because of our favorite player...

My 2 cents

Sent from my LG-P990 using Tapatalk 2
Mav, this is a great point and what I was talking about. love your post. how do you judge? who will adopt how? give a wooden racquet to Djokovic or Fed and watch them play  :)).  Bring young JMac and Borg in their prime, and give them modern racquets, speed up Wimbledon grass, put them against Fed or Sampras and let's see what happens.  I think it would be hilarious. all players in their prime  :)>>>>

Thanks! :)) It would be hilarious and amazing to watch all player in their prime against each other... We can only dream of it! :))

Offline Start da Game

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clearly boris knows 1000 times more than what we know.......

And clearly Agassi, Wilander, McEnroe even Borg know more than we do... that hasn't stop them to proclaim Fed as the best... So, does that mean they have come up with a scientific fact that Fed is the best or even worse than they? NO....

agassi is a bitter washed up oldy who got owned by pete........mcenroe runs with the flow, called nadal GOAT as well........nobody is more bitter about rafa than borg.......
Marian Vajda to Novak Djokovic, "I saw you beat that man like I never saw no man get beat before, and the man KEPT COMING AFTER YOU! Now we don't need no man like that in our lives."

i demand french open to be renamed RAFAEL GARROS

Offline jesse james

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clearly boris knows 1000 times more than what we know.......

And clearly Agassi, Wilander, McEnroe even Borg know more than we do... that hasn't stop them to proclaim Fed as the best... So, does that mean they have come up with a scientific fact that Fed is the best or even worse than they? NO....

agassi is a bitter washed up oldy who got owned by pete........mcenroe runs with the flow, called nadal GOAT as well........nobody is more bitter about rafa than borg.......

I'ld have thought being bitter and washed up would be something you could relate to on a personal level.
I am a lighthouse worn by the weather and the waves
And though I'm empty I still warn the sailors on their way

Offline jesse james

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clearly boris knows 1000 times more than what we know.......

right brains, do you wanna walk me through that statement or is it just more of the utter meaningless crap you write in here?
I am a lighthouse worn by the weather and the waves
And though I'm empty I still warn the sailors on their way

Offline mav140

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clearly boris knows 1000 times more than what we know.......

And clearly Agassi, Wilander, McEnroe even Borg know more than we do... that hasn't stop them to proclaim Fed as the best... So, does that mean they have come up with a scientific fact that Fed is the best or even worse than they? NO....

agassi is a bitter washed up oldy who got owned by pete........mcenroe runs with the flow, called nadal GOAT as well........nobody is more bitter about rafa than borg.......

LOOOOOL... you are talking about Agassi, McEnroe, Borg like that?? And you are calling Boris Becker objective??? Have you ever seen him play? he was probably the sorest loser of them all... LMFAO... you are just hilarious!

It's good we have people like you on the forum.. I need some kicks and laughs from time to time.. your posts does do that to me!! hilarious.

I have to wait for your anwer to this... Cause you didn't say anything about Wilander, how about Connors, or Courier? Pat Cash? and the list could be a mile long if you have anything on all of them.... just give me a short phrase into what a sore loser, pathetic, bitter, washed up players like these are...

And I still think they are entitled to an opinion and know a lot more about tennis than we do, but that doesn't make it a fact......
« Last Edit: November 07, 2012, 08:30:19 AM by mav140 »

Offline Start da Game

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clearly boris knows 1000 times more than what we know.......

right brains, do you wanna walk me through that statement or is it just more of the utter meaningless crap you write in here?

it seems to me that statement hit right into your living room spilling your morning tea...... 
Marian Vajda to Novak Djokovic, "I saw you beat that man like I never saw no man get beat before, and the man KEPT COMING AFTER YOU! Now we don't need no man like that in our lives."

i demand french open to be renamed RAFAEL GARROS

Offline Start da Game

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clearly boris knows 1000 times more than what we know.......

And clearly Agassi, Wilander, McEnroe even Borg know more than we do... that hasn't stop them to proclaim Fed as the best... So, does that mean they have come up with a scientific fact that Fed is the best or even worse than they? NO....

agassi is a bitter washed up oldy who got owned by pete........mcenroe runs with the flow, called nadal GOAT as well........nobody is more bitter about rafa than borg.......

LOOOOOL... you are talking about Agassi, McEnroe, Borg like that?? And you are calling Boris Becker objective??? Have you ever seen him play? he was probably the sorest loser of them all... LMFAO... you are just hilarious!

It's good we have people like you on the forum.. I need some kicks and laughs from time to time.. your posts does do that to me!! hilarious.

I have to wait for your anwer to this... Cause you didn't say anything about Wilander, how about Connors, or Courier? Pat Cash? and the list could be a mile long if you have anything on all of them.... just give me a short phrase into what a sore loser, pathetic, bitter, washed up players like these are...

And I still think they are entitled to an opinion and know a lot more about tennis than we do, but that doesn't make it a fact......

all the players mentioned above know more than us but most of them let their favouritism and bitterness affect their judgment........boris is not that kind, neither is guga or steffi graf.......they speak honest and unbiased.........

where were you in 2009 when boris was awed at federer's 6 wimbledon titles and called them far greater than renshaw's when a fellow commentator said that federer still needs one more to equal renshaw?

courier and wilander are garbage given their repetitive fed loving activities in public........they are a disgrace to tennis commentary........
Marian Vajda to Novak Djokovic, "I saw you beat that man like I never saw no man get beat before, and the man KEPT COMING AFTER YOU! Now we don't need no man like that in our lives."

i demand french open to be renamed RAFAEL GARROS

Offline mav140

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clearly boris knows 1000 times more than what we know.......

And clearly Agassi, Wilander, McEnroe even Borg know more than we do... that hasn't stop them to proclaim Fed as the best... So, does that mean they have come up with a scientific fact that Fed is the best or even worse than they? NO....

agassi is a bitter washed up oldy who got owned by pete........mcenroe runs with the flow, called nadal GOAT as well........nobody is more bitter about rafa than borg.......

LOOOOOL... you are talking about Agassi, McEnroe, Borg like that?? And you are calling Boris Becker objective??? Have you ever seen him play? he was probably the sorest loser of them all... LMFAO... you are just hilarious!

It's good we have people like you on the forum.. I need some kicks and laughs from time to time.. your posts does do that to me!! hilarious.

I have to wait for your anwer to this... Cause you didn't say anything about Wilander, how about Connors, or Courier? Pat Cash? and the list could be a mile long if you have anything on all of them.... just give me a short phrase into what a sore loser, pathetic, bitter, washed up players like these are...

And I still think they are entitled to an opinion and know a lot more about tennis than we do, but that doesn't make it a fact......

all the players mentioned above know more than us but most of them let their favouritism and bitterness affect their judgment........boris is not that kind, neither is guga or steffi graf.......they speak honest and unbiased.........

where were you in 2009 when boris was awed at federer's 6 wimbledon titles and called them far greater than renshaw's when a fellow commentator said that federer still needs one more to equal renshaw?

courier and wilander are garbage given their repetitive fed loving activities in public........they are a disgrace to tennis commentary........

If you have read all my posts in this thread, I said Boris changes his mind like he changes underwear.... but as always, you only read what you want to read...

Now all the great players from every era let their favouritisim get the best of them?? And the ones that don' are garbage? And only Guga and Graff are objective and unbiased????? REALLY??? ARE YOU LISTENING TO YOURSELF??? LOOOOOOOLL... just sad...

So, let all the world know that the opinion of ALL THE GREATS of the sports are garbage, biased, EXCEPT for JUST Guga and Graff!!!! You heard it here first folks!!!  :rofl_2: :rofl_2: :rofl_2: :rofl_2: :rofl_2: :rofl_2: :rofl_2: :rofl_2: :rofl_2: :rofl_2: :rofl_2:

what one's got to hear!
« Last Edit: November 07, 2012, 09:03:01 AM by mav140 »