Author Topic: The Great Tommy Haas: What Is Driving Him And How Far Can He Go  (Read 1519 times)

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Offline Lugburz

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Re: The Great Tommy Haas: What Is Driving Him And How Far Can He Go
« Reply #40 on: June 02, 2013, 09:57:54 AM »
You honestly believe Ferrer has a good net game :confused1:
I don't like repeating myself, but I've seen enough of Ferrer to call him defensive player. The only attacking thing about him is that he has a feel for deep balls returned. Unlike Simon(another defensive player) who puts balls in awkward and weird places.
But thats too far away from being aggressive or point dictator.

Nadal is aggressor but not offensive minded player. Sometimes thats a huge difference. You simply can't put him alongside offensive minded players like Haas, Blake, Federer, Berdych, Soderling, Tsonga etc etc.

Nadal does dictates the point with his ultra mega top spin, but that doesn't necessarily make other to go defensive.
Nadal will wait for the opportune moment to hit you with a huge fh winner. Thats not called offensive minded, thats called tactically outsmarting opponent 'til he cracks.

The sad thing is, that respectful game is no where to be seen at this RG.
In the absence of light, darkness prevails!
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TOMMY HAAS
Philipp Kohlschreiber  -  Stanislas Wawrinka - TB - NM - GD - EG - IS - DL - RF - DT - JWT

Offline huntingyou

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Re: The Great Tommy Haas: What Is Driving Him And How Far Can He Go
« Reply #41 on: June 02, 2013, 10:06:07 AM »
You honestly believe Ferrer has a good net game :confused1:
I don't like repeating myself, but I've seen enough of Ferrer to call him defensive player. The only attacking thing about him is that he has a feel for deep balls returned. Unlike Simon(another defensive player) who puts balls in awkward and weird places.
But thats too far away from being aggressive or point dictator.

Nadal is aggressor but not offensive minded player. Sometimes thats a huge difference. You simply can't put him alongside offensive minded players like Haas, Blake, Federer, Berdych, Soderling, Tsonga etc etc.

Nadal does dictates the point with his ultra mega top spin, but that doesn't necessarily make other to go defensive.
Nadal will wait for the opportune moment to hit you with a huge fh winner. Thats not called offensive minded, thats called tactically outsmarting opponent 'til he cracks.

The sad thing is, that respectful game is no where to be seen at this RG.

I think you are caught too much in labels......these players transcends such labels.

Ferrer could be categorized as defensive still, but it will be fool to ignore the improvement in his game like his net skills for example. I never called it Sampras like but the guy can successfully close the net during difficult situation and put the ball away.

Your Nadal description sounds like you are confuse. Maybe you are looking only at the difference between flat hitting and topspin hitting. The funny thing is he actually hits very flat with his backhand when he goes CC and the change in direction when he goes DTL with the forehand it's an offensive tactic.....there is no other way to put it. Nadal doesn't wait for a moment against most players; I think the marathon matches with Novak and Murray has much to do with what you are saying. Watch Rafa playing lower ranking players, like Haas for example and tell me that he is waiting for a moment.

Yes, his game sucks at the moment....don't know why. He looked good at Rome.


 

Offline williamchung7

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Re: The Great Tommy Haas: What Is Driving Him And How Far Can He Go
« Reply #42 on: June 02, 2013, 10:12:52 AM »
Who want to some drink or pop corn?

Offline Lugburz

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Re: The Great Tommy Haas: What Is Driving Him And How Far Can He Go
« Reply #43 on: June 02, 2013, 10:19:32 AM »
Let's put an end to this because we'll start going in circles.
Ferrer's net game is only good when he's finishing off the point, by driving the opponent away. Good net game, well watch again Haas vs Djokovic in Miami. I said that match because its fresh and you probably have seen it and its not typical S&V style, its chip and charges where you can see more variety on net game and that's where you know its a good net game.
If not watch the most of Haas' matches in 2009 where he had to play more S&V due to his injuries.

Again, I know it sounds like excuses, but honestly most of Haas matches vs Nadal aren't good indicators for what I've already stated. Some due to injuries and some in the very peaks of Nadal's game.

He already upgraded his defensive game to slightly aggressive in the past, but he's going passive again.

You are also confusing yourself with your remark about flat shots and top spins. No one can play top spin like Nadal.
Haas mostly uses top spin anf flat shots, but Haas' top spins are no where near Nadal's. Their are simply not the same shots. If they were, Haas wouldn't have trouble with Nadal's HIGH bouncing balls.
Now if you play tennis like you claim you do, you would know how much harder is to hit winners with high bounce than for example Haas' top spins and flat shots.
In the absence of light, darkness prevails!
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TOMMY HAAS
Philipp Kohlschreiber  -  Stanislas Wawrinka - TB - NM - GD - EG - IS - DL - RF - DT - JWT

Online Babblelot

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Re: The Great Tommy Haas: What Is Driving Him And How Far Can He Go
« Reply #44 on: June 02, 2013, 10:23:46 AM »
Let's put an end to this because we'll start going in circles.


I put an end to this a page ago!
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Offline monstertruck

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Re: The Great Tommy Haas: What Is Driving Him And How Far Can He Go
« Reply #45 on: June 02, 2013, 10:50:48 AM »

He figured Ferrer's game(like there's something to figure)

B

A little bit condescending eh? Ferrer is twice the tennis player Tommy will ever be;.................. blahblahblahblah something about Nadal blahblahblah...............................   Sometimes I ask myself when I read people dismissing the talents of someone like Ferrer or categorize Nadal as a "defensive" player if they have ever hit a tennis ball.
When exactly was it that Ferrer was #2 in the world (as Herc mentioned at the top of the page).

Let's see what David has accomplished by age 35. ;-()

CONK da ball!!!

Offline Lugburz

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Re: The Great Tommy Haas: What Is Driving Him And How Far Can He Go
« Reply #46 on: June 02, 2013, 11:11:48 AM »
When exactly was it that Ferrer was #2 in the world (as Herc mentioned at the top of the page).

Let's see what David has accomplished by age 35. ;-()



The thing is, if I said that he would attack me how I'm wrong even though I didn't comment/criticize his opinion that he think that Ferrer is much better and more talented player. I really don't want to prove him wrong nor to change his opinion.

And Haas being #2 back then, I'm almost sure he'll come up with some weak/strong era nonsense excuse.


Hunting has always been feeling the need to attack my opinions on tennis, and sadly that hasn't change even though, as you can see, I'm the one that tries to 'extend friendship hand'.
I'll put all behind me, because I gain nothing at all by arguing with other members(besides tennis)
In the absence of light, darkness prevails!
------------------------------------------------------

TOMMY HAAS
Philipp Kohlschreiber  -  Stanislas Wawrinka - TB - NM - GD - EG - IS - DL - RF - DT - JWT

Offline huntingyou

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Re: The Great Tommy Haas: What Is Driving Him And How Far Can He Go
« Reply #47 on: June 02, 2013, 12:24:39 PM »

He figured Ferrer's game(like there's something to figure)

B

A little bit condescending eh? Ferrer is twice the tennis player Tommy will ever be;.................. blahblahblahblah something about Nadal blahblahblah...............................   Sometimes I ask myself when I read people dismissing the talents of someone like Ferrer or categorize Nadal as a "defensive" player if they have ever hit a tennis ball.
When exactly was it that Ferrer was #2 in the world (as Herc mentioned at the top of the page).

Let's see what David has accomplished by age 35. ;-()

Ferrer:

20 Career titles, 18 Finals, 5 GS SF, highest rank #4, 518W-255L

Haas:

14 career titles, 12 Finals, 4 GS SF, highest rank #2, 521W-292L


Haas achieved #2 ranking in 2002; Ferrer has been playing his best tennis in the era of the Big 3.

Tennis is about winning matches and Ferrer it's more proficient at winning matches than Haas. As shown above, Ferrer has performed better as well in the biggest of stages. The guy has been to 5 QF at the Slams as well.

Age is relative since Haas has been sideline for a portion of his career while Ferrer has reached his peak later on his career. The guy is 31 playing his best tennis.....who knows where he will be at age 35. It's a moot point.


Offline Emma

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Re: The Great Tommy Haas: What Is Driving Him And How Far Can He Go
« Reply #48 on: June 02, 2013, 12:29:05 PM »
I'll take Haas over Ferrer on any given day. Ferrer bores to death.
You are everything I am not.

Offline huntingyou

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Re: The Great Tommy Haas: What Is Driving Him And How Far Can He Go
« Reply #49 on: June 02, 2013, 12:36:49 PM »
When exactly was it that Ferrer was #2 in the world (as Herc mentioned at the top of the page).

Let's see what David has accomplished by age 35. ;-()



The thing is, if I said that he would attack me how I'm wrong even though I didn't comment/criticize his opinion that he think that Ferrer is much better and more talented player. I really don't want to prove him wrong nor to change his opinion.

And Haas being #2 back then, I'm almost sure he'll come up with some weak/strong era nonsense excuse.


Hunting has always been feeling the need to attack my opinions on tennis, and sadly that hasn't change even though, as you can see, I'm the one that tries to 'extend friendship hand'.
I'll put all behind me, because I gain nothing at all by arguing with other members(besides tennis)

me addressing your opinions on a tennis board it's attacking?............... :ZZZZZ)

You can't prove anything, I have addressed the subject at hands in the past with clarity......if there is such a thing as "winning" an internet argument; I'm sad you haven't experience such.

Case in point, I'm talking about Ferrer's net game improving RELATIVE to his own game a few years ago and you can't grasp the concept. I'm not even saying his volleys skills are superior to Haas but superior to HIMSELF from a few years back. Do you even watch the guy play? Do you think he has defended and grind his way to the QF at RG this year? The guy has been an efficient killer out there. It's he a better tennis player than Haas? You are damn right he is. Is he more talented? No, but talent it's just a piece of the puzzle........it's useless without all the elements needed to succeed at the highest level

Nadal? Just forget about it, you can't see and I have no interest in making you see. All you come up it's with excuses, I asked who is the aggressor when Rafa plays Haas and you bring more excuses. Peak Nadal? Injured Haas?  You spend too much time on the internet.


Offline huntingyou

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Re: The Great Tommy Haas: What Is Driving Him And How Far Can He Go
« Reply #50 on: June 02, 2013, 12:37:29 PM »
I'll take Haas over Ferrer on any given day. Ferrer bores to death.

I'm sure Ferrer and his opponents care  ..-)

Offline Lugburz

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Re: The Great Tommy Haas: What Is Driving Him And How Far Can He Go
« Reply #51 on: June 02, 2013, 12:43:47 PM »
When exactly was it that Ferrer was #2 in the world (as Herc mentioned at the top of the page).

Let's see what David has accomplished by age 35. ;-()



The thing is, if I said that he would attack me how I'm wrong even though I didn't comment/criticize his opinion that he think that Ferrer is much better and more talented player. I really don't want to prove him wrong nor to change his opinion.

And Haas being #2 back then, I'm almost sure he'll come up with some weak/strong era nonsense excuse.


Hunting has always been feeling the need to attack my opinions on tennis, and sadly that hasn't change even though, as you can see, I'm the one that tries to 'extend friendship hand'.
I'll put all behind me, because I gain nothing at all by arguing with other members(besides tennis)

me addressing your opinions on a tennis board it's attacking?............... :ZZZZZ)

You can't prove anything, I have addressed the subject at hands in the past with clarity......if there is such a thing as "winning" an internet argument; I'm sad you haven't experience such.

Case in point, I'm talking about Ferrer's net game improving RELATIVE to his own game a few years ago and you can't grasp the concept. I'm not even saying his volleys skills are superior to Haas but superior to HIMSELF from a few years back. Do you even watch the guy play? Do you think he has defended and grind his way to the QF at RG this year? The guy has been an efficient killer out there. It's he a better tennis player than Haas? You are damn right he is. Is he more talented? No, but talent it's just a piece of the puzzle........it's useless without all the elements needed to succeed at the highest level

Nadal? Just forget about it, you can't see and I have no interest in making you see. All you come up it's with excuses, I asked who is the aggressor when Rafa plays Haas and you bring more excuses. Peak Nadal? Injured Haas?  You spend too much time on the internet.

You are hopeless.


In the absence of light, darkness prevails!
------------------------------------------------------

TOMMY HAAS
Philipp Kohlschreiber  -  Stanislas Wawrinka - TB - NM - GD - EG - IS - DL - RF - DT - JWT

Offline huntingyou

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Re: The Great Tommy Haas: What Is Driving Him And How Far Can He Go
« Reply #52 on: June 02, 2013, 12:46:13 PM »

You are hopeless.

That's what they always say when argument is lost  :rofl_2:

maybe Nadal "mega topspin" it's messing with your vibe. I forgot to asked, How Nadal creates those "mega topspin"? Maybe you could tell Haas

Offline Emma

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Re: The Great Tommy Haas: What Is Driving Him And How Far Can He Go
« Reply #53 on: June 02, 2013, 12:47:04 PM »
Forget it, Luggy. Not worth it.
You are everything I am not.

Offline Lugburz

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Re: The Great Tommy Haas: What Is Driving Him And How Far Can He Go
« Reply #54 on: June 02, 2013, 12:47:44 PM »
Forget it, Luggy. Not worth it.

I know  ;-()
In the absence of light, darkness prevails!
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TOMMY HAAS
Philipp Kohlschreiber  -  Stanislas Wawrinka - TB - NM - GD - EG - IS - DL - RF - DT - JWT

Offline huntingyou

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Re: The Great Tommy Haas: What Is Driving Him And How Far Can He Go
« Reply #55 on: June 02, 2013, 12:50:04 PM »
Forget it, Luggy. Not worth it.

not worthy at all.........yet you are posting in this thread. Give him a hug on my behalf, I like Luggy very much!

Offline Emma

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Re: The Great Tommy Haas: What Is Driving Him And How Far Can He Go
« Reply #56 on: June 02, 2013, 12:53:45 PM »
Forget it, Luggy. Not worth it.

not worthy at all.........yet you are posting in this thread. Give him a hug on my behalf, I like Luggy very much!

That's very good to know. Thank you.
You are everything I am not.

Offline Lugburz

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Re: The Great Tommy Haas: What Is Driving Him And How Far Can He Go
« Reply #57 on: June 02, 2013, 12:54:34 PM »
Forget it, Luggy. Not worth it.

not worthy at all.........yet you are posting in this thread. Give him a hug on my behalf, I like Luggy very much!

It was you who got this thread off topic anyway.
No need to be sarcastic, its only my good will to be friendly most of the time.
In the absence of light, darkness prevails!
------------------------------------------------------

TOMMY HAAS
Philipp Kohlschreiber  -  Stanislas Wawrinka - TB - NM - GD - EG - IS - DL - RF - DT - JWT

Offline huntingyou

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Re: The Great Tommy Haas: What Is Driving Him And How Far Can He Go
« Reply #58 on: June 02, 2013, 01:02:12 PM »
Forget it, Luggy. Not worth it.

not worthy at all.........yet you are posting in this thread. Give him a hug on my behalf, I like Luggy very much!

It was you who got this thread off topic anyway.
No need to be sarcastic, its only my good will to be friendly most of the time.

My second half to that sentence was not sarcastic. I enjoy most of your posts very much!

Let's go back to on topic:

Haas it's riding good health, great motivation and ability to adapt his game to the point where I will not be surprise to see him achieve top 10 status before the end of the years. Grass Season will be key for his ranking. His game translate very beautiful to grass and we all know he can do well both at Halle and SW19.

Can he avoid injury? I think that's the only limitation at this point. I thought he wasted an opportunity by not dispatching Isner in three sets. He needs to avoid the grind of the clay!

Offline Lugburz

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Re: The Great Tommy Haas: What Is Driving Him And How Far Can He Go
« Reply #59 on: June 02, 2013, 01:14:12 PM »
I thought you were sarcastic because iirc that was the 1st time I heard you call me Luggy  ..-)
However if you weren't and I believe you, all good then!
Just for the record : Even though I don't like Ferrer's game I'm definitely not taking anything away from Ferrer. But you really rushed things saying Ferrer is better player due to his stats. Just consider that Tommy had 20+ injuries/illnes during his career, with 3 major right shoulder injuries and 1 major hip surgery. Its all speculation, but imagine if he didn't get injured in crucial parts of his career.


To the topic:
top 10 is really not a problem (by the end of the year) considering he lost in R1 both in Wimbly and USO. Also he didn't play Paris Masters and he'll need to defend R2 at Cincy.
Avoiding the injuries is the key, he has the game to go to the top8 even, if all goes well.


In the absence of light, darkness prevails!
------------------------------------------------------

TOMMY HAAS
Philipp Kohlschreiber  -  Stanislas Wawrinka - TB - NM - GD - EG - IS - DL - RF - DT - JWT