Author Topic: Sportsmanship or not  (Read 10540 times)

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Offline Chris1987

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« Reply #60 on: April 05, 2006, 12:35:38 AM »
Quote from: "wilsonboy"
Quote from: "ChrisTaylor1987"
Quote from: "wilsonboy"
let me add on to that: Expect the unexpected that is within the rules.


It is within the rules that's why she was aloud to go, there wasn't too much more of a delay as it was 90 seconds for the changeover anyway.


I twas not in the rules! You're only allowed to go for a bathroom break on an even score! The umpire debated be4 she let Maria go.


Maria was aloud to go to the toilet as simple as that, she went at the change of ends so very little time was wasted and Golovin wasn't forced to wait much longer. Golovin went onto win the game and the set anyway so there is well too much fuss being made of this. If Maria had broken Golovin for 6/4 and won the match I could understand this a bit more, but the bottom line is at that stage Maria thought she couldn't last any longer and didn't at all break up the rhythm of Golovin.
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Offline Chris1987

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« Reply #61 on: April 05, 2006, 12:37:42 AM »
Quote from: "Dallas"
Hey wilsonboy and others....don't you know you're not going to win this argument against Chris!  He's defending his favorite no matter what... nothing less than we should expect.  I know I would expect you to defend Serena like that - as well as me and JadeFox would defend Roger... so let Chris have the last word and then we can move on to other subjects. :))


You've got me worked out very well Dallas :H , I will always defend Maria whatever the situation or whatever she has done, that's just nature to me and like you said you and Jade will defend Roger whatever happens and Wilson will always defend Serena whatever happens. It's great to remain loyal. :)
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Offline John Mcenroe

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« Reply #62 on: April 05, 2006, 01:27:01 AM »
What if she kills someone?

Then would you cover for Maria?

Offline wilsonboy

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« Reply #63 on: April 05, 2006, 06:13:09 AM »
There's a fine line between loyalty and denial...
Be the change that you seek.

Offline Chris1987

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« Reply #64 on: April 05, 2006, 07:38:54 AM »
Quote from: "John Mcenroe"
What if she kills someone?

Then would you cover for Maria?


Yeah, right up until the moment she is found guilty. If I heard Maria may have murdered someone I'd back her all the way until she was found guilty and then even if she was found guilty I'd still want to know her reasons for it. Don't want to talk about that much as i really can't and don't want to imagine it.
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Offline Chris1987

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« Reply #65 on: April 05, 2006, 07:39:35 AM »
Quote from: "wilsonboy"
There's a fine line between loyalty and denial...


Well this is complete loyalty Wilson, you should know that.
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Offline JadeFox21

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« Reply #66 on: April 05, 2006, 10:52:36 AM »
Quote from: "Dallas"
Hey wilsonboy and others....don't you know you're not going to win this argument against Chris!  He's defending his favorite no matter what... nothing less than we should expect.  I know I would expect you to defend Serena like that - as well as me and JadeFox would defend Roger... so let Chris have the last word and then we can move on to other subjects. :))


Yeah, I would defend Roger, especially after meeting him.  I just don't think he would knowingly be unsportsmanlike on any occasion.  Some people thought he was when he questioned that one lineswoman in the Final.  But he was just asking her whether she called out while signaling good.  And she admitted she did.  But the chair umpire felt that Roger really had no play on the ball anyway, so there was no let.  I think Roger wanted a let but didn't get it...so he moved on.  He certainly wasn't questioning whether the ball was good or not...he knew it was good.  And of course, the same lineswoman did the same thing again, so Roger had a point.
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Offline wilsonboy

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« Reply #67 on: April 05, 2006, 07:19:56 PM »
Yeah, but Federer is not like that. Sharapova has always had somekind of a slight attitude and this is something that I expected from her.
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Offline wilsonboy

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« Reply #68 on: April 05, 2006, 09:24:09 PM »
Quote
...Then, when you return and see me writhing in pain with trainers tending to my injury -- writer's cramps and all -- just avert your gaze, ignoring the fact that we're colleagues and have known each other for years. Don't worry, your daddy will reassure you it was a classy way to behave. Just those ogres in the media and that annoying Carillo trying to stir up controversy. Your lack of compassion or sportsmanship isn't creepy, Ken. You're just an intense, goal-oriented dude.

Sharapova's absence of class and grace against Tatiana Golovin was topic numero uno among you guys. "I think she took a page out of Justine Henin-Hardenne's book, Playing Dirty My Way," wrote Keith of Minneapolis. "The apple doesn't fall far from the win-at-all-costs tree" wrote Patrick of Denver. And on and on it went.

This is neither new nor surprising. Sharapova is a hyper-motivated player whose intensity is to be admired. The underbelly, as we've seen before, is a galling level of self-absorption and a general tone-deafness to common courtesy. In Sharapova's defense, she still recalls the time Serena Williams fell during the 2004 WTA Championships. Sharapova acted solicitously, and before she knew it, Serena had reeled off four straight games. Also, she was gracious after the match. (We hear Sharapova and Golovin are even sitting courtside together at the Miami Heat game Thursday night.)

But overall I think she could use a crash course in decorum. You'd think that as the WTA's de facto figurehead, she would want to represent her sport as well as possible. (See: Federer, Roger.) And short of that, there are crass commercial reasons to support an attitude adjustment. It's great that she can attach her name to every product under the sun (and, in full disclosure, pose for the Sports Illustrated swimsuit issue). But how much longer can she turn entire stadiums against her and expect the endorsement booty to roll in? How much longer can she get blasted on ESPN and still expect to seduce Madison Avenue?

To me, this is symptomatic of a larger issue. We love women's tennis. Really, we do. But maybe the WTA (with underwriting provided by Sony Ericsson) might want to hold a symposium for players on the topic of professionalism and sportsmanship. Some possible topics:

You don't bail on event after event with highly questionable injuries only to show up drunk at Oscar parties. You don't quit in the second set of a Grand Slam final with a tummy ache. You don't get a shiatsu massage from the trainer or venture to the water closet every time you're losing. You don't accept the blatant mid-match coaching from your coach or father. You don't hit practice serves into the back wall when your opponent is writhing in pain.

Time and again lately, the sport has come off looking small. If I'm Larry Scott, this concerns me every bit as much as whether the simian (pardon the pun) French Federation offers equal prize money to second-round doubles losers.


It seems that others have the same views on Sharapova.
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Offline Chris1987

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« Reply #69 on: April 06, 2006, 12:41:24 AM »
Quote from: "wilsonboy"
Quote
...Then, when you return and see me writhing in pain with trainers tending to my injury -- writer's cramps and all -- just avert your gaze, ignoring the fact that we're colleagues and have known each other for years. Don't worry, your daddy will reassure you it was a classy way to behave. Just those ogres in the media and that annoying Carillo trying to stir up controversy. Your lack of compassion or sportsmanship isn't creepy, Ken. You're just an intense, goal-oriented dude.

Sharapova's absence of class and grace against Tatiana Golovin was topic numero uno among you guys. "I think she took a page out of Justine Henin-Hardenne's book, Playing Dirty My Way," wrote Keith of Minneapolis. "The apple doesn't fall far from the win-at-all-costs tree" wrote Patrick of Denver. And on and on it went.

This is neither new nor surprising. Sharapova is a hyper-motivated player whose intensity is to be admired. The underbelly, as we've seen before, is a galling level of self-absorption and a general tone-deafness to common courtesy. In Sharapova's defense, she still recalls the time Serena Williams fell during the 2004 WTA Championships. Sharapova acted solicitously, and before she knew it, Serena had reeled off four straight games. Also, she was gracious after the match. (We hear Sharapova and Golovin are even sitting courtside together at the Miami Heat game Thursday night.)

But overall I think she could use a crash course in decorum. You'd think that as the WTA's de facto figurehead, she would want to represent her sport as well as possible. (See: Federer, Roger.) And short of that, there are crass commercial reasons to support an attitude adjustment. It's great that she can attach her name to every product under the sun (and, in full disclosure, pose for the Sports Illustrated swimsuit issue). But how much longer can she turn entire stadiums against her and expect the endorsement booty to roll in? How much longer can she get blasted on ESPN and still expect to seduce Madison Avenue?

To me, this is symptomatic of a larger issue. We love women's tennis. Really, we do. But maybe the WTA (with underwriting provided by Sony Ericsson) might want to hold a symposium for players on the topic of professionalism and sportsmanship. Some possible topics:

You don't bail on event after event with highly questionable injuries only to show up drunk at Oscar parties. You don't quit in the second set of a Grand Slam final with a tummy ache. You don't get a shiatsu massage from the trainer or venture to the water closet every time you're losing. You don't accept the blatant mid-match coaching from your coach or father. You don't hit practice serves into the back wall when your opponent is writhing in pain.

Time and again lately, the sport has come off looking small. If I'm Larry Scott, this concerns me every bit as much as whether the simian (pardon the pun) French Federation offers equal prize money to second-round doubles losers.


It seems that others have the same views on Sharapova.


That's what matters, how Maria does on the court, and when you play in such an intesity it is hard to just come out of that and then straight back into it, there's plenty of time for sportsmanship off the court, what happens on court should be completely different to offcourt. What good would it have been Maria going over to Golovin?, Maria's no doctor or medic, so she would have beeen standing there uselessly. Same as what was the good in Maria saying to Golovin 'Are you okay?' Golovin's response 'Does it look like I'm okay to you?' Neither player wouldn't have got anything from it, so it was best to do how they did it, Maria asking and seeing Golovin after the match and going to the basketball together. What people are saying after the event is pretty pointless right now, as Maria is really not going to be bothered by it at all, she has her reasons clear as to why she acted like she did and that's the important thing.
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Offline wilsonboy

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« Reply #70 on: April 06, 2006, 06:11:18 AM »
Well, they're supposed to be good friends so why wouldn't Sharapova rush to her aid even if it was just cramps?
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Offline Chris1987

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« Reply #71 on: April 06, 2006, 06:15:57 AM »
Quote from: "wilsonboy"
Well, they're supposed to be good friends so why wouldn't Sharapova rush to her aid even if it was just cramps?


I'll say it again, what good would Maria be going over the Golovin?, she's no medic to say the least and would have just got in the way of the professional(s), who were trying to treat Golovin.
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Offline Arcforce

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« Reply #72 on: April 06, 2006, 02:25:17 PM »
Quote from: "ChrisTaylor1987"
Quote from: "wilsonboy"
Well, they're supposed to be good friends so why wouldn't Sharapova rush to her aid even if it was just cramps?


I'll say it again, what good would Maria be going over the Golovin?, she's no medic to say the least and would have just got in the way of the professional(s), who were trying to treat Golovin.


I think more than her actually doing something, it was just the display of concern that everyone wanted to see. If someone close to you got shot, you would run over to them too. Of course there's nothing you can do to help them! But you wouldn't just stand there from 100 feet away and watch. People just wanted to see that she wasnt a cold hearted person. And she pretty much proved them right..

Offline Chris1987

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« Reply #73 on: April 06, 2006, 02:40:16 PM »
Quote from: "Arcforce"
Quote from: "ChrisTaylor1987"
Quote from: "wilsonboy"
Well, they're supposed to be good friends so why wouldn't Sharapova rush to her aid even if it was just cramps?


I'll say it again, what good would Maria be going over the Golovin?, she's no medic to say the least and would have just got in the way of the professional(s), who were trying to treat Golovin.


I think more than her actually doing something, it was just the display of concern that everyone wanted to see. If someone close to you got shot, you would run over to them too. Of course there's nothing you can do to help them! But you wouldn't just stand there from 100 feet away and watch. People just wanted to see that she wasnt a cold hearted person. And she pretty much proved them right..


And why does Maria have to oblige with what people want to see?, she is on the court to win matches and tournaments not to be the winner of a popularity contest. The majority of players couldn't really give a damn about what the crowd expect them to do, so why should Maria do what the crowd and supporters wanted to see from her?
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Offline Arcforce

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« Reply #74 on: April 06, 2006, 03:19:38 PM »
Quote from: "ChrisTaylor1987"
Quote from: "Arcforce"
Quote from: "ChrisTaylor1987"
Quote from: "wilsonboy"
Well, they're supposed to be good friends so why wouldn't Sharapova rush to her aid even if it was just cramps?


I'll say it again, what good would Maria be going over the Golovin?, she's no medic to say the least and would have just got in the way of the professional(s), who were trying to treat Golovin.


I think more than her actually doing something, it was just the display of concern that everyone wanted to see. If someone close to you got shot, you would run over to them too. Of course there's nothing you can do to help them! But you wouldn't just stand there from 100 feet away and watch. People just wanted to see that she wasnt a cold hearted person. And she pretty much proved them right..


And why does Maria have to oblige with what people want to see?, she is on the court to win matches and tournaments not to be the winner of a popularity contest. The majority of players couldn't really give a damn about what the crowd expect them to do, so why should Maria do what the crowd and supporters wanted to see from her?


She doesnt. But it would be appreciated if you stopped creating ordeals over the fact that everyone hates her. Yes, you're right. She doesn't have to be a likable person at all and she isn't. You've accepted it but you won't accept the fact that everyone hates her. Get over it and move on. Replying to threads like this further proves MY point that Maria doesnt care at all about faking like she's a nice person since she really is as cold hearted as people think she is. The least she could do is try to be a likable figure. But she doesnt. That's why we hate her. Get it now?

Offline Chris1987

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« Reply #75 on: April 06, 2006, 03:29:47 PM »
Quote from: "Arcforce"
Quote from: "ChrisTaylor1987"
Quote from: "Arcforce"
Quote from: "ChrisTaylor1987"
Quote from: "wilsonboy"
Well, they're supposed to be good friends so why wouldn't Sharapova rush to her aid even if it was just cramps?


I'll say it again, what good would Maria be going over the Golovin?, she's no medic to say the least and would have just got in the way of the professional(s), who were trying to treat Golovin.


I think more than her actually doing something, it was just the display of concern that everyone wanted to see. If someone close to you got shot, you would run over to them too. Of course there's nothing you can do to help them! But you wouldn't just stand there from 100 feet away and watch. People just wanted to see that she wasnt a cold hearted person. And she pretty much proved them right..


And why does Maria have to oblige with what people want to see?, she is on the court to win matches and tournaments not to be the winner of a popularity contest. The majority of players couldn't really give a damn about what the crowd expect them to do, so why should Maria do what the crowd and supporters wanted to see from her?


She doesnt. But it would be appreciated if you stopped creating ordeals over the fact that everyone hates her. Yes, you're right. She doesn't have to be a likable person at all and she isn't. You've accepted it but you won't accept the fact that everyone hates her. Get over it and move on. Replying to threads like this further proves MY point that Maria doesnt care at all about faking like she's a nice person since she really is as cold hearted as people think she is. The least she could do is try to be a likable figure. But she doesnt. That's why we hate her. Get it now?


Who said anything about people hating her or not hating her? You may want to read some posts a little more as I quite simply said why should Maria try to be a crowd pleaser and try to become really popular with the crowd, as it won't help her game? So where you have got the fact I don't accept people hate Maria is beyond me as that wasn't even in the conversation.
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Offline JadeFox21

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« Reply #76 on: April 06, 2006, 04:32:45 PM »
Quote from: "ChrisTaylor1987"
And why does Maria have to oblige with what people want to see?, she is on the court to win matches and tournaments not to be the winner of a popularity contest. The majority of players couldn't really give a damn about what the crowd expect them to do, so why should Maria do what the crowd and supporters wanted to see from her?


You're right that Maria doesn't owe anyone anything.  But as a top tennis player, not only does she owe it to her sport to play the best she can (which she does) but also to represent her sport in the best possible light.  I guess that is what this debate is all about.  And I'm sure her big-bucks sponsors weren't too happy with the fallout of this match.  As a sponsor, they certainly want the public to adore Maria and that match didn't help matters.   Like I said, when I was in Miami, I enjoyed watching her practice and got a new appreciation for her game.  But I must admit that I wished she had shown a little bit of concern for Golovin at the time of the injury - it would have done wonders for her public personna.

But like you say...she doesn't have to do it.  She chose not to.  Sometimes it doesn't matter what someone 'meant' by something...the perception becomes the reality.  You know, JHH may very well have been too sick to continue the AO Final, but the perception was way worse and that perception will haunt her.  I just hope that Maria will remember that and understand that the perception of 'not caring' is what people remember no matter what her true intention was.  That's just the way it is.
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Offline cgw

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« Reply #77 on: April 06, 2006, 04:44:30 PM »
WB, please note the first sentence of your italicized paragraph (in the article you posted). Seems that "others" feel the same way that some feel about Serena, too.
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Offline Arcforce

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« Reply #78 on: April 06, 2006, 05:51:30 PM »
Quote from: "ChrisTaylor1987"
Quote from: "Arcforce"
Quote from: "ChrisTaylor1987"
Quote from: "Arcforce"
Quote from: "ChrisTaylor1987"
Quote from: "wilsonboy"
Well, they're supposed to be good friends so why wouldn't Sharapova rush to her aid even if it was just cramps?


I'll say it again, what good would Maria be going over the Golovin?, she's no medic to say the least and would have just got in the way of the professional(s), who were trying to treat Golovin.


I think more than her actually doing something, it was just the display of concern that everyone wanted to see. If someone close to you got shot, you would run over to them too. Of course there's nothing you can do to help them! But you wouldn't just stand there from 100 feet away and watch. People just wanted to see that she wasnt a cold hearted person. And she pretty much proved them right..


And why does Maria have to oblige with what people want to see?, she is on the court to win matches and tournaments not to be the winner of a popularity contest. The majority of players couldn't really give a damn about what the crowd expect them to do, so why should Maria do what the crowd and supporters wanted to see from her?


She doesnt. But it would be appreciated if you stopped creating ordeals over the fact that everyone hates her. Yes, you're right. She doesn't have to be a likable person at all and she isn't. You've accepted it but you won't accept the fact that everyone hates her. Get over it and move on. Replying to threads like this further proves MY point that Maria doesnt care at all about faking like she's a nice person since she really is as cold hearted as people think she is. The least she could do is try to be a likable figure. But she doesnt. That's why we hate her. Get it now?


Who said anything about people hating her or not hating her? You may want to read some posts a little more as I quite simply said why should Maria try to be a crowd pleaser and try to become really popular with the crowd, as it won't help her game? So where you have got the fact I don't accept people hate Maria is beyond me as that wasn't even in the conversation.


Nope, I don't really need to read anything. Its blatantly apparent in your behavior that you feel the need to impose your obsession with Maria on everyone else. Otherwise you wouldn't care when people brought out her flaws and you certainly wouldn't spend 4 pages worth of posts "defending" her behavior if that were not the case.

Everyone knows Maria is not as friendly and lovable as you and the rest of the media want her to seem. So what? It's not the end of the world. She's cold and heartless so let it go and stop spending your life and pages upon pages of posts trying to convince everyone with eyes otherwise.

Offline wilsonboy

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« Reply #79 on: April 06, 2006, 08:53:18 PM »
Quote from: "cgw"
WB, please note the first sentence of your italicized paragraph (in the article you posted). Seems that "others" feel the same way that some feel about Serena, too.


I know that. and I can admit that.
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