Author Topic: Hose Higueras' impact  (Read 10934 times)

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Offline TennisVeritas

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Re: Hose Higueras' impact
« Reply #80 on: June 13, 2008, 01:50:33 AM »
With the grass courts getting slower and slower i don't know if its a very wise idea to teach serve and volley to a young budding player..because most of the players today are such good baseliners..sure it steals some variety and beauty in the game..but its effectiveness we are talking about...I think SNV is a technique that comes a bit naturally..like super quick reflexes..they can be taught to a certain extent...may be transition game can be taught but after that if you are at the net..it depends solely on how your reflexes are..a case in point..Lendl was a good baseliner (sampras calls him a top 5 material of all times) yet we see that he failed to do very well near the net..perhaps that's why he never won the wimby..when he reached the finals of the wmby in 86 against a very young and athletic Becker, Becker served and volleyed his way and went on to hold serve quite conveniently but brought Lendl close to the net on the return games and Lendl could not match up with Becker's superb net play. Though fresh from winning the french, Lendl lost in straight sets to the champion...Lendl thereafter tried to improve his net play on many occasions yet failed to do it on grass...that is I'm trying to say that Becker had excellent reflexes at the net as a 17 or an 18 year old...while Lendl 'knew' how to play at the net and yet could not put it to much effect perhaps because he 'learnt' how to play at teh net a bit late...That's where I'm talking about Jose's influence..we know that Fed has got the game at the net yet its the effectiveness we are talking about..Fed's anticipation is superb while Pete's reflexes were out of the world and that's where the two differ at their net play. SnV can be taught to kids only if the coach identifies his charge to be 'really' effective at the net..something what Pete's coach did..Pete used to play his backhand with both hands and had a talent near the net..so the coach made Pete to play the backhand with a single hand and this took his net game to a new level.[/color][/size]

Great post: I really agree on the points I have stressed..

But this is why I do not see Pete as being a (potential) great coach: His game was based mainly on some elements that you cannot easily explain and teach to someone other: So, I really do not believe it will be a great idea for Djoko to have Pete as a coach to prepare Wimbledon, IMO, the "aggression to the net" (more than the "simple" S&V because it implies as well the charge on respond games) is something that can be done if and only if you have a player with superior skills either in term of anticipations (FED) or reflexes (Pete)..

Djoko is good on both (might be more in anticipations that reflexes) but he is not exceptional..IMO: the real guy who will be able to do more out there to aggress from the net is  Andy Murray: Yes this guy, I saw him in the first week at RG (against Eysseric-VERY TALENTED LEFTY PLAYER BTW), he has a superior anticipations skills and the reflexes are also at a very high level:

Unfortunately, Murray does not believe enough on his own skills and weapons. Against Eysseric he started to play aggressive at the net and short the rallies only after he was down 2 sets to 1.

BTW: Gilbert tried to push him to a more aggressive (at the net) Tennis..Conclusion: He decided to end the collaboration!! It is really a shame IMO. But, ok, there is still time in front of him and might be someone will at the end convince him that the right strategy is the one of being more aggressive at the net and short the rallies.

So as a conclusion, out there are certainly guys who will be able to implement a successfully a (sort) of Pete's aggressive strategy (once again Andy is at the top of my list at the moment, but there is Gublis / Gasquet and others) BUT they have to believe on it (difficult given the quality of today's passing shot) and it will become more and more difficult to implement given the high level of the defence game out there (more it is even imprioving with the time!!) 
« Last Edit: June 13, 2008, 02:17:13 AM by TennisVeritas »
"The more you lose, the more they believe they can beat me. But believing is not enough, you still have to beat me" Roger Federer.

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Offline TennisVeritas

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Re: Hose Higueras' impact
« Reply #81 on: June 13, 2008, 02:04:04 AM »
hahahahahaha US open is your hot-spot.......that is the worst tournament these days and is disgusting to watch.......those are the quickest surfaces on earth and players don't even have a clue on how to use the pace to their progression during matches.......

at least guys like nole, nadal are having some guts and that "in your face" character to take it to any one even and if they aren't equipped with good volleying skills, they are at least good enough to have a crack at any one from the baseline......the rest of the players are not even half good as they are......anyway i have always maintained some exceptions to the group of "clowns", because of whom tennis is still somewhat interesting at times......


You should at least learn two or three FACTS:

1) This is your opinion, i.e. the USO is the less attractive one and this is not something you can be proved in any objective way so this is not TRUE for everyone: It is a questions of preferences..Conclusion: Start to respect other preferences..It will be already a great step forward, mr. arrogant.
 
2) I did not say that this is my preferred GS: I said this is the most tricky competitive wise to obtain ("nuance" is french like "cretin")..I GUESS, YOU THINK JUST THE OPPOSITE BECAUSE FED HAS JUST WON 4 USO IN A ROW SO IT NEEDS TO BE EASY AND TERRIBLE TO WATCH :whistle: :whistle:

3) My preferred Slam is Wimbledon: it always was and always will be..

you ain't getting the point straight.......intentionally diverting yourself to things like federer is winning that, federer is losing that and so i am posting like that.....as i said earlier, you are getting too protective on federer......seriously something's wrong with you.i think maybe it's your psyche......maybe i am subjective here.......lol.....because some people might perceive things differently from your posts, like the above one for example......


And what are your points?..That the same bunch of players are great champions when they are playing against Rafa on clay (or even out of that surface) and they suddenly become clowns when they play against FED (whatever the surface)??..

If there is someone that has a problem between us this is you: You continue to celebrate Rafa's results and in the same time you cancel the FED's ones because obtained against "clowns".
IF YOU DID NOT NOTICE I WILL TELL YOU :rofl_2:: THEY ARE PLAYING IN THE SAME ERA..THEY ARE WITH US, PRESENT DAYS, SO YOU ARE APPLYING A DOUBLE STANDARD BASED ON BAD FEELINGS (HATE) AGAINST FED:

NOTHING IS OBJECTIVE IN YOUR ANALYSIS: YOU ARE TOTALY BIASED AND ARROGANT SO..


BTW: I at the contrary, I have no problems: Rafa's results on clay are so exceptional that he is already at the level of Borg, i.e. the best I had the opportunity to see on that surface on the open era..AND AT THE SAME TIME, FED's results (in the last 5 years) are just so exceptional that at the moment is already there among the all time great of the open era, i.e. Borg-Pete-FED.

In other words you should start have a close look to what Rafa's opinions, i.e. what is the opinion of a very intelligent, humble (so different from you  :rofl_2:) and smart (great) player:

"Roger's still the favourite for Wimbledon, that's for sure, as he has won five trophies in the last five years," said the top seed at this week's Artois Championships, who would plainly prefer to eat biscuits than to gloat or brag about how he destroyed the world No 1 in Paris.

"For sure, anything can happen at Wimbledon, but Roger is special and a complete player on grass. I don't think what happened in Paris on Sunday is going to have an effect on him psychologically. I think to lose in the way he did, in straight sets, that will not have any effect on his mind at Wimbledon. It would have been worse for him if I had beaten him 6-4 or 7-5 in the fifth set, as then he would have been very close to the title. That would have been more difficult for Roger to take. I know that Roger is going to be strong at Wimbledon."

Rafa and Roger have formed a mutual appreciation society, so don't expect a return to the back-biting and trash-talking of the McEnroe-Connors era. "I have total respect for Roger," Nadal said. "What Roger has done over the past few years is so impressive, only losing a few matches each year, it's almost impossible what he has done. Even if you are the world No 1, it's impossible to go through a season with a 100 per cent record. Roger can't win every match and every tournament. He has lost more matches this year than in the previous years during his time as the world No 1, but he made the semi-finals at the Australian Open and then the final in Paris. No one can say that he is having a bad year."

In Nadal's mind, Federer is already a tennis 'great'. "It's difficult for me to say whether Roger is the greatest player in history. But I think that he is already one of the greatest," said Nadal, hoping he will become the first Spanish man to win Wimbledon since Manuel Santana in 1966.


More about this interview here: http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/main.jhtml?view=DETAILS&grid=&xml=/sport/2008/06/13/stnada113.xml

On that side the only feature you are sharing with Rafa is the same age..A part from that  :rofl_2: :rofl_2: :rofl_2:
« Last Edit: June 13, 2008, 03:36:01 AM by TennisVeritas »
"The more you lose, the more they believe they can beat me. But believing is not enough, you still have to beat me" Roger Federer.

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Offline Start da Game

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Re: Hose Higueras' impact
« Reply #82 on: June 13, 2008, 05:14:44 AM »
 :rofl_2: :rofl_2: :rofl_2: :rofl_2: :rofl_2:Tennis Veritas :rofl_2: :rofl_2: :rofl_2: :rofl_2: :rofl_2:


^^^maybe that will attract your eyes more than my post below......but still hoping that you will read my posts without jumping on to the reply button as soon as you see my post......

   I had given you enough reasons on why those are not a great competition for fed on grass and hards and why federer is having poor results on clay. Either you agree or disagree, that's fine and you can do that in a mannered way.......but it seems like you are frightened of peeping into the reality that he lost to guys like volandri, stepanek etc. on clay!!!!!!! Instead you are just filling your reply to my posts with non-sense that can be heard from one ear and can be left from the other......I can understand your anguish and I know you haven't still overcome the last sunday's battering, it's very clear from your posts, on why you are bringing rafa here into the discussion......lol.....what of those words from rafa there? some warm, humble words, unlike federer.....seriously, u make me laugh......lol......

 
Marian Vajda to Novak Djokovic, "I saw you beat that man like I never saw no man get beat before, and the man KEPT COMING AFTER YOU! Now we don't need no man like that in our lives."

i demand french open to be renamed RAFAEL GARROS

Offline Start da Game

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Re: Hose Higueras' impact
« Reply #83 on: June 13, 2008, 05:37:24 AM »
With the grass courts getting slower and slower i don't know if its a very wise idea to teach serve and volley to a young budding player..because most of the players today are such good baseliners..sure it steals some variety and beauty in the game..but its effectiveness we are talking about...I think SNV is a technique that comes a bit naturally..like super quick reflexes..they can be taught to a certain extent...may be transition game can be taught but after that if you are at the net..it depends solely on how your reflexes are..a case in point..Lendl was a good baseliner (sampras calls him a top 5 material of all times) yet we see that he failed to do very well near the net..perhaps that's why he never won the wimby..when he reached the finals of the wmby in 86 against a very young and athletic Becker, Becker served and volleyed his way and went on to hold serve quite conveniently but brought Lendl close to the net on the return games and Lendl could not match up with Becker's superb net play. Though fresh from winning the french, Lendl lost in straight sets to the champion...Lendl thereafter tried to improve his net play on many occasions yet failed to do it on grass...that is I'm trying to say that Becker had excellent reflexes at the net as a 17 or an 18 year old...while Lendl 'knew' how to play at the net and yet could not put it to much effect perhaps because he 'learnt' how to play at teh net a bit late...That's where I'm talking about Jose's influence..we know that Fed has got the game at the net yet its the effectiveness we are talking about..Fed's anticipation is superb while Pete's reflexes were out of the world and that's where the two differ at their net play. SnV can be taught to kids only if the coach identifies his charge to be 'really' effective at the net..something what Pete's coach did..Pete used to play his backhand with both hands and had a talent near the net..so the coach made Pete to play the backhand with a single hand and this took his net game to a new level.
All you are saying here would essentially boil down to ability of a particular player once again.......and you are absolutely right.......SNV skills are instinct based skills.......they can be taught to an extent, but from there on it's a player's pure ability to develop, tune those skills and advance them immensely.......the present sorry state of SNV in men's game is because of both i guess......prime example is roddick......he tries his hand at SNV now and then, but the fellow simply hasn't got the touch at the net.......the rest of the guys don't even try that and now I don't even bother to start on why they are reluctant.......
Marian Vajda to Novak Djokovic, "I saw you beat that man like I never saw no man get beat before, and the man KEPT COMING AFTER YOU! Now we don't need no man like that in our lives."

i demand french open to be renamed RAFAEL GARROS

Offline Start da Game

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Re: Hose Higueras' impact
« Reply #84 on: June 13, 2008, 05:45:49 AM »
coming back to the topic, by the next clay season, do you think federer will improve his SNV skills further and think of approaching the net or will he simply get back to the baseline and try his luck? first if his strategy is sure-shot, then it depends on what kind of coach he needs and who would be better for the job......but if he gets caught between the ideas by the next season, no coach can do anything......the fed camp will need a psychologist first then......
Marian Vajda to Novak Djokovic, "I saw you beat that man like I never saw no man get beat before, and the man KEPT COMING AFTER YOU! Now we don't need no man like that in our lives."

i demand french open to be renamed RAFAEL GARROS

Offline TennisVeritas

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Re: Hose Higueras' impact
« Reply #85 on: June 13, 2008, 05:50:30 AM »
:rofl_2: :rofl_2: :rofl_2: :rofl_2: :rofl_2:Tennis Veritas :rofl_2: :rofl_2: :rofl_2: :rofl_2: :rofl_2:


^^^maybe that will attract your eyes more than my post below......but still hoping that you will read my posts without jumping on to the reply button as soon as you see my post......

   I had given you enough reasons on why those are not a great competition for fed on grass and hards and why federer is having poor results on clay. Either you agree or disagree, that's fine and you can do that in a mannered way.......but it seems like you are frightened of peeping into the reality that he lost to guys like volandri, stepanek etc. on clay!!!!!!! Instead you are just filling your reply to my posts with non-sense that can be heard from one ear and can be left from the other......I can understand your anguish and I know you haven't still overcome the last sunday's battering, it's very clear from your posts, on why you are bringing rafa here into the discussion......lol.....what of those words from rafa there? some warm, humble words, unlike federer.....seriously, u make me laugh......lol......

I can conclude with:

No man is exempt from saying silly things; the mischief is to say them deliberately. :whistle:

AND

As Voltaire once said "Appreciation is a wonderful thing. It makes what is excellent in others belong to us as well" ..-)

Best Regards,
TV
"The more you lose, the more they believe they can beat me. But believing is not enough, you still have to beat me" Roger Federer.

We can be knowledgeable with other men's knowledge, we can only be wise with our own wisdom

Offline Start da Game

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Re: Hose Higueras' impact
« Reply #86 on: June 13, 2008, 05:57:59 AM »
Then try to appreciate the players of 90s, like i am appreciating federer.......Anyway, nice that you have somehow foreseen the danger of administrator throwing both of us out of here, and concluded......regards from my side too.....btw we have quarreled and peaced the matters successfully for the 2nd time now.......catch you again mate......lol
Marian Vajda to Novak Djokovic, "I saw you beat that man like I never saw no man get beat before, and the man KEPT COMING AFTER YOU! Now we don't need no man like that in our lives."

i demand french open to be renamed RAFAEL GARROS

Offline TennisVeritas

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Re: Hose Higueras' impact
« Reply #87 on: June 13, 2008, 06:52:24 AM »
:rofl_2: :rofl_2: :rofl_2: :rofl_2: :rofl_2:Tennis Veritas :rofl_2: :rofl_2: :rofl_2: :rofl_2: :rofl_2:


^^^maybe that will attract your eyes more than my post below......but still hoping that you will read my posts without jumping on to the reply button as soon as you see my post......

   I had given you enough reasons on why those are not a great competition for fed on grass and hards and why federer is having poor results on clay. Either you agree or disagree, that's fine and you can do that in a mannered way.......but it seems like you are frightened of peeping into the reality that he lost to guys like volandri, stepanek etc. on clay!!!!!!! Instead you are just filling your reply to my posts with non-sense that can be heard from one ear and can be left from the other......I can understand your anguish and I know you haven't still overcome the last sunday's battering, it's very clear from your posts, on why you are bringing rafa here into the discussion......lol.....what of those words from rafa there? some warm, humble words, unlike federer.....seriously, u make me laugh......lol......

I can conclude with:

No man is exempt from saying silly things; the mischief is to say them deliberately. :whistle:

AND

As Voltaire once said "Appreciation is a wonderful thing. It makes what is excellent in others belong to us as well" ..-)

Best Regards,
TV

TO ASSURE THE CONCLUSION,YESTERDAY YOU POSTED:

I agree that there is a lack of clay court specialists these days too......but, the criterion for the clay judgement is satisfactory enough with the presence of numerous baseliners who play predominantly a clay court game on hardcourts too round the year.now that should only make clay court competition relatively tougher than the other surfaces......

WHICH MEANS RAFA'S CLAY RESULTS ARE NOT SO GREAT: HE HAD TO FACE A CLOWNS OPPOSITIONS.. :whistle:

AND AT THE SAME TIME WE KNOW THAT YOU THINK THAT FED'S RESUME IN THE LAST 4 YEARS IS JUST CR@P BECAUSE HE WAS PLAYING AGAINST (THE SAME) CLOWNS, WHO WERE TRYING TO PLAY CLAY COURT TENNIS EVEN OUT OF CLAY  :rofl_2: (AROD WAS DOING THAT, DJOKO, SAFIN, BLAKE  :rofl_2:...)

CONCLUSION: NOWADAYS, THEY ARE ALL CLOWS OUT THERE AND TENNIS ENDED IN THE '90..THIS IS YOUR VIEW: I THINK IT IS SILLY.


 :// ://
« Last Edit: June 13, 2008, 07:21:57 AM by TennisVeritas »
"The more you lose, the more they believe they can beat me. But believing is not enough, you still have to beat me" Roger Federer.

We can be knowledgeable with other men's knowledge, we can only be wise with our own wisdom

Offline falcon

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Re: Hose Higueras' impact
« Reply #88 on: June 13, 2008, 08:08:47 AM »
coming back to the topic, by the next clay season, do you think federer will improve his SNV skills further and think of approaching the net or will he simply get back to the baseline and try his luck? first if his strategy is sure-shot, then it depends on what kind of coach he needs and who would be better for the job......but if he gets caught between the ideas by the next season, no coach can do anything......the fed camp will need a psychologist first then......

Look I think at the age Federer is in..he'll be 27 by next RG...that's not an age wherein you learn new tricks in the game..Nole, Nadal are in an age where they can do things..they can develop a lot more...very few have won the RG beyond the age of 26..only Agassi I guess has been able to do it when he was past 26...time is ticking and I know that Fed is never going to win the RG because even if Rafa fails to do it...perhaps for some unexplained reasons...there's always Nole..I think a lot depends on the YE ranking of Fed I guess if he still ends up as no:1 (which i seriously doubt) then his morale will be high enough to try one more time...but if he ends up as say no:3 or even 2 then I guess he's not going to even try winning it cos its not going to help his cause because he'll then give up trying to win RG and will try on breaking Sampras's record alone..even for non clay slams he needs a psychologist who'll talk to him to bring back his confidence...he started the year on a rather poor note but I see him improving steadily but we are never going to see the roger of 05-06...that champion's aura is lost forever from this champion..but even if he intends getting 2 or 3 more slams he needs morale boosting more than anything else...and todays tennis is harsh on players because most hit their prime at the ages between 21-26 and in women's case its even lesser highlighted by the fact that hingis, kim,Ju all retired young...the elder ones...amelie,venus, or even on the men's side..santoro,bjorkman, Moya are just lingering around and time is ticking for Rog...if he intends breaking sampras's record he has to do so within the next year and a half to two years...wheich leaves him to contend for atleast 6 GS's out of which 2 are RG...which leaves him with 4-5 slams to compete in...can he do it? Will Jose do what Annacone did for Sampras? Only time will tell...but then Annacone was one person Sampras trusted in...I don't know if Jose is a full fledged coach for Fed because we know that Fed likes to have his space while training...and unless there's someone out there to change his approach entirely...I can't say anything because I believe everyone needs to have a coach even the best in the world...but Fed needs him all the more...but how much is Jose going to change the dipping fortunes of our champion?


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Offline Start da Game

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Re: Hose Higueras' impact
« Reply #89 on: June 13, 2008, 08:18:36 AM »
:rofl_2: :rofl_2: :rofl_2: :rofl_2: :rofl_2:Tennis Veritas :rofl_2: :rofl_2: :rofl_2: :rofl_2: :rofl_2:


^^^maybe that will attract your eyes more than my post below......but still hoping that you will read my posts without jumping on to the reply button as soon as you see my post......

   I had given you enough reasons on why those are not a great competition for fed on grass and hards and why federer is having poor results on clay. Either you agree or disagree, that's fine and you can do that in a mannered way.......but it seems like you are frightened of peeping into the reality that he lost to guys like volandri, stepanek etc. on clay!!!!!!! Instead you are just filling your reply to my posts with non-sense that can be heard from one ear and can be left from the other......I can understand your anguish and I know you haven't still overcome the last sunday's battering, it's very clear from your posts, on why you are bringing rafa here into the discussion......lol.....what of those words from rafa there? some warm, humble words, unlike federer.....seriously, u make me laugh......lol......

I can conclude with:

No man is exempt from saying silly things; the mischief is to say them deliberately. :whistle:

AND

As Voltaire once said "Appreciation is a wonderful thing. It makes what is excellent in others belong to us as well" ..-)

Best Regards,
TV

TO ASSURE THE CONCLUSION,YESTERDAY YOU POSTED:

I agree that there is a lack of clay court specialists these days too......but, the criterion for the clay judgement is satisfactory enough with the presence of numerous baseliners who play predominantly a clay court game on hardcourts too round the year.now that should only make clay court competition relatively tougher than the other surfaces......

WHICH MEANS RAFA'S CLAY RESULTS ARE NOT SO GREAT: HE HAD TO FACE A CLOWNS OPPOSITIONS.. :whistle:

AND AT THE SAME TIME WE KNOW THAT YOU THINK THAT FED'S RESUME IN THE LAST 4 YEARS IS JUST CR@P BECAUSE HE WAS PLAYING AGAINST (THE SAME) CLOWNS, WHO WERE TRYING TO PLAY CLAY COURT TENNIS EVEN OUT OF CLAY  :rofl_2: (AROD WAS DOING THAT, DJOKO, SAFIN, BLAKE  :rofl_2:...)

CONCLUSION: NOWADAYS, THEY ARE ALL CLOWS OUT THERE AND TENNIS ENDED IN THE '90..THIS IS YOUR VIEW: I THINK IT IS SILLY.

 :// ://
seriously something's wrong with you man.......happy ending anyway......
Marian Vajda to Novak Djokovic, "I saw you beat that man like I never saw no man get beat before, and the man KEPT COMING AFTER YOU! Now we don't need no man like that in our lives."

i demand french open to be renamed RAFAEL GARROS

Offline Start da Game

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Re: Hose Higueras' impact
« Reply #90 on: June 13, 2008, 08:33:05 AM »
coming back to the topic, by the next clay season, do you think federer will improve his SNV skills further and think of approaching the net or will he simply get back to the baseline and try his luck? first if his strategy is sure-shot, then it depends on what kind of coach he needs and who would be better for the job......but if he gets caught between the ideas by the next season, no coach can do anything......the fed camp will need a psychologist first then......

Look I think at the age Federer is in..he'll be 27 by next RG...that's not an age wherein you learn new tricks in the game..Nole, Nadal are in an age where they can do things..they can develop a lot more...very few have won the RG beyond the age of 26..only Agassi I guess has been able to do it when he was past 26...time is ticking and I know that Fed is never going to win the RG because even if Rafa fails to do it...perhaps for some unexplained reasons...there's always Nole..I think a lot depends on the YE ranking of Fed I guess if he still ends up as no:1 (which i seriously doubt) then his morale will be high enough to try one more time...but if he ends up as say no:3 or even 2 then I guess he's not going to even try winning it cos its not going to help his cause because he'll then give up trying to win RG and will try on breaking Sampras's record alone..even for non clay slams he needs a psychologist who'll talk to him to bring back his confidence...he started the year on a rather poor note but I see him improving steadily but we are never going to see the roger of 05-06...that champion's aura is lost forever from this champion..but even if he intends getting 2 or 3 more slams he needs morale boosting more than anything else...and todays tennis is harsh on players because most hit their prime at the ages between 21-26 and in women's case its even lesser highlighted by the fact that hingis, kim,Ju all retired young...the elder ones...amelie,venus, or even on the men's side..santoro,bjorkman, Moya are just lingering around and time is ticking for Rog...if he intends breaking sampras's record he has to do so within the next year and a half to two years...wheich leaves him to contend for atleast 6 GS's out of which 2 are RG...which leaves him with 4-5 slams to compete in...can he do it? Will Jose do what Annacone did for Sampras? Only time will tell...but then Annacone was one person Sampras trusted in...I don't know if Jose is a full fledged coach for Fed because we know that Fed likes to have his space while training...and unless there's someone out there to change his approach entirely...I can't say anything because I believe everyone needs to have a coach even the best in the world...but Fed needs him all the more...but how much is Jose going to change the dipping fortunes of our champion?
don't write such comments even if they are real, or else some of his fans will accuse us of hating him......

on a serious note, if i am not wrong, lendl started to improve his serve late in his career at 25,26 and developed a good serve in a couple of years, which helped him immensely to do well at wimbledon and he reached a couple of wimbledon finals after that.......so, i don't count out the possibilities of federer improving upon his skills but i tend to agree with you that he should have done that a bit earlier, say some 2 or 3 years ago......like you said nole and rafa can improve vastly with age on their side, federer may improve somewhat but not as quick and solid as a young 20 yr old can do........
Marian Vajda to Novak Djokovic, "I saw you beat that man like I never saw no man get beat before, and the man KEPT COMING AFTER YOU! Now we don't need no man like that in our lives."

i demand french open to be renamed RAFAEL GARROS

Offline Alison2006

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Re: Hose Higueras' impact
« Reply #91 on: June 13, 2008, 06:13:23 PM »
Tennisveritas may I ask you your views on Andy Murray  :whistle: I only ask you as your are such an expert on Tennis, I would like to know your views on his game.

I only ask you on this thread as this is where most of your time is spent (or on the RF thread)  :)

Would you bring your expert view over om my Andy Murray thread please?

It will make a change to hear your expert views on another player

Thankyou

IT's been quite a change to hear you not mention Federer in one or two posts, good job Alison :good:

TV is one of the only people who goes through the trouble to point out Fed-haters double standards and thier fantastic logic, I don't know why he tries.. its pointless  :\

I mention plenty of other players thank you, sometimes they are ignored though, on the ATP and WTA

As for Tennisveritas pointing out "Fed- haters" (try harder with the "Fed-haters point please) it's getting boring, I have explained my point of view on him and I have never used the word "hate", ANYWAY moving on...  :)  Yes TV does do that, but perhaps he could start with his own DOUBLE STANDARDS (which is never brought up by Fed Fans..........it's gently ignored )

Double standards are on both sides
I never thought he would win 4 French Opens - Roger Federer on Rafa

Offline falcon

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Re: Hose Higueras' impact
« Reply #92 on: June 13, 2008, 07:58:48 PM »
coming back to the topic, by the next clay season, do you think federer will improve his SNV skills further and think of approaching the net or will he simply get back to the baseline and try his luck? first if his strategy is sure-shot, then it depends on what kind of coach he needs and who would be better for the job......but if he gets caught between the ideas by the next season, no coach can do anything......the fed camp will need a psychologist first then......

Look I think at the age Federer is in..he'll be 27 by next RG...that's not an age wherein you learn new tricks in the game..Nole, Nadal are in an age where they can do things..they can develop a lot more...very few have won the RG beyond the age of 26..only Agassi I guess has been able to do it when he was past 26...time is ticking and I know that Fed is never going to win the RG because even if Rafa fails to do it...perhaps for some unexplained reasons...there's always Nole..I think a lot depends on the YE ranking of Fed I guess if he still ends up as no:1 (which i seriously doubt) then his morale will be high enough to try one more time...but if he ends up as say no:3 or even 2 then I guess he's not going to even try winning it cos its not going to help his cause because he'll then give up trying to win RG and will try on breaking Sampras's record alone..even for non clay slams he needs a psychologist who'll talk to him to bring back his confidence...he started the year on a rather poor note but I see him improving steadily but we are never going to see the roger of 05-06...that champion's aura is lost forever from this champion..but even if he intends getting 2 or 3 more slams he needs morale boosting more than anything else...and todays tennis is harsh on players because most hit their prime at the ages between 21-26 and in women's case its even lesser highlighted by the fact that hingis, kim,Ju all retired young...the elder ones...amelie,venus, or even on the men's side..santoro,bjorkman, Moya are just lingering around and time is ticking for Rog...if he intends breaking sampras's record he has to do so within the next year and a half to two years...wheich leaves him to contend for atleast 6 GS's out of which 2 are RG...which leaves him with 4-5 slams to compete in...can he do it? Will Jose do what Annacone did for Sampras? Only time will tell...but then Annacone was one person Sampras trusted in...I don't know if Jose is a full fledged coach for Fed because we know that Fed likes to have his space while training...and unless there's someone out there to change his approach entirely...I can't say anything because I believe everyone needs to have a coach even the best in the world...but Fed needs him all the more...but how much is Jose going to change the dipping fortunes of our champion?
don't write such comments even if they are real, or else some of his fans will accuse us of hating him......

on a serious note, if i am not wrong, lendl started to improve his serve late in his career at 25,26 and developed a good serve in a couple of years, which helped him immensely to do well at wimbledon and he reached a couple of wimbledon finals after that.......so, i don't count out the possibilities of federer improving upon his skills but i tend to agree with you that he should have done that a bit earlier, say some 2 or 3 years ago......like you said nole and rafa can improve vastly with age on their side, federer may improve somewhat but not as quick and solid as a young 20 yr old can do........


well but that's the truth isn't it? :)) Oh c'mon every champion falls...no one can go on playing year after year at the same level..and it good that Fed has been doing it all this while and its just that now he's not doing well..its normal and I don't see him coming out of nowhere and doing what he was doing for the past 4 years...
Yes about Lendl...he did improve his serve but never went on to win in wimby...but I was stressing on net play...Fed is very good with his serve and stuff but to improve his net game I think he's on the wrong side of  twenty.


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Re: Hose Higueras' impact
« Reply #93 on: June 13, 2008, 08:03:54 PM »
With the grass courts getting slower and slower i don't know if its a very wise idea to teach serve and volley to a young budding player..because most of the players today are such good baseliners..sure it steals some variety and beauty in the game..but its effectiveness we are talking about...I think SNV is a technique that comes a bit naturally..like super quick reflexes..they can be taught to a certain extent...may be transition game can be taught but after that if you are at the net..it depends solely on how your reflexes are..a case in point..Lendl was a good baseliner (sampras calls him a top 5 material of all times) yet we see that he failed to do very well near the net..perhaps that's why he never won the wimby..when he reached the finals of the wmby in 86 against a very young and athletic Becker, Becker served and volleyed his way and went on to hold serve quite conveniently but brought Lendl close to the net on the return games and Lendl could not match up with Becker's superb net play. Though fresh from winning the french, Lendl lost in straight sets to the champion...Lendl thereafter tried to improve his net play on many occasions yet failed to do it on grass...that is I'm trying to say that Becker had excellent reflexes at the net as a 17 or an 18 year old...while Lendl 'knew' how to play at the net and yet could not put it to much effect perhaps because he 'learnt' how to play at teh net a bit late...That's where I'm talking about Jose's influence..we know that Fed has got the game at the net yet its the effectiveness we are talking about..Fed's anticipation is superb while Pete's reflexes were out of the world and that's where the two differ at their net play. SnV can be taught to kids only if the coach identifies his charge to be 'really' effective at the net..something what Pete's coach did..Pete used to play his backhand with both hands and had a talent near the net..so the coach made Pete to play the backhand with a single hand and this took his net game to a new level.

Great post!
Good Luck on the Court!!!
Scott Baker
http://www.tennis4you.com

Offline falcon

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Re: Hose Higueras' impact
« Reply #94 on: June 13, 2008, 08:18:25 PM »
With the grass courts getting slower and slower i don't know if its a very wise idea to teach serve and volley to a young budding player..because most of the players today are such good baseliners..sure it steals some variety and beauty in the game..but its effectiveness we are talking about...I think SNV is a technique that comes a bit naturally..like super quick reflexes..they can be taught to a certain extent...may be transition game can be taught but after that if you are at the net..it depends solely on how your reflexes are..a case in point..Lendl was a good baseliner (sampras calls him a top 5 material of all times) yet we see that he failed to do very well near the net..perhaps that's why he never won the wimby..when he reached the finals of the wmby in 86 against a very young and athletic Becker, Becker served and volleyed his way and went on to hold serve quite conveniently but brought Lendl close to the net on the return games and Lendl could not match up with Becker's superb net play. Though fresh from winning the french, Lendl lost in straight sets to the champion...Lendl thereafter tried to improve his net play on many occasions yet failed to do it on grass...that is I'm trying to say that Becker had excellent reflexes at the net as a 17 or an 18 year old...while Lendl 'knew' how to play at the net and yet could not put it to much effect perhaps because he 'learnt' how to play at teh net a bit late...That's where I'm talking about Jose's influence..we know that Fed has got the game at the net yet its the effectiveness we are talking about..Fed's anticipation is superb while Pete's reflexes were out of the world and that's where the two differ at their net play. SnV can be taught to kids only if the coach identifies his charge to be 'really' effective at the net..something what Pete's coach did..Pete used to play his backhand with both hands and had a talent near the net..so the coach made Pete to play the backhand with a single hand and this took his net game to a new level.

Great post!


aw thanks  :))


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Offline Start da Game

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Re: Hose Higueras' impact
« Reply #95 on: June 14, 2008, 03:37:57 AM »
coming back to the topic, by the next clay season, do you think federer will improve his SNV skills further and think of approaching the net or will he simply get back to the baseline and try his luck? first if his strategy is sure-shot, then it depends on what kind of coach he needs and who would be better for the job......but if he gets caught between the ideas by the next season, no coach can do anything......the fed camp will need a psychologist first then......

Look I think at the age Federer is in..he'll be 27 by next RG...that's not an age wherein you learn new tricks in the game..Nole, Nadal are in an age where they can do things..they can develop a lot more...very few have won the RG beyond the age of 26..only Agassi I guess has been able to do it when he was past 26...time is ticking and I know that Fed is never going to win the RG because even if Rafa fails to do it...perhaps for some unexplained reasons...there's always Nole..I think a lot depends on the YE ranking of Fed I guess if he still ends up as no:1 (which i seriously doubt) then his morale will be high enough to try one more time...but if he ends up as say no:3 or even 2 then I guess he's not going to even try winning it cos its not going to help his cause because he'll then give up trying to win RG and will try on breaking Sampras's record alone..even for non clay slams he needs a psychologist who'll talk to him to bring back his confidence...he started the year on a rather poor note but I see him improving steadily but we are never going to see the roger of 05-06...that champion's aura is lost forever from this champion..but even if he intends getting 2 or 3 more slams he needs morale boosting more than anything else...and todays tennis is harsh on players because most hit their prime at the ages between 21-26 and in women's case its even lesser highlighted by the fact that hingis, kim,Ju all retired young...the elder ones...amelie,venus, or even on the men's side..santoro,bjorkman, Moya are just lingering around and time is ticking for Rog...if he intends breaking sampras's record he has to do so within the next year and a half to two years...wheich leaves him to contend for atleast 6 GS's out of which 2 are RG...which leaves him with 4-5 slams to compete in...can he do it? Will Jose do what Annacone did for Sampras? Only time will tell...but then Annacone was one person Sampras trusted in...I don't know if Jose is a full fledged coach for Fed because we know that Fed likes to have his space while training...and unless there's someone out there to change his approach entirely...I can't say anything because I believe everyone needs to have a coach even the best in the world...but Fed needs him all the more...but how much is Jose going to change the dipping fortunes of our champion?
don't write such comments even if they are real, or else some of his fans will accuse us of hating him......

on a serious note, if i am not wrong, lendl started to improve his serve late in his career at 25,26 and developed a good serve in a couple of years, which helped him immensely to do well at wimbledon and he reached a couple of wimbledon finals after that.......so, i don't count out the possibilities of federer improving upon his skills but i tend to agree with you that he should have done that a bit earlier, say some 2 or 3 years ago......like you said nole and rafa can improve vastly with age on their side, federer may improve somewhat but not as quick and solid as a young 20 yr old can do........


well but that's the truth isn't it? :)) Oh c'mon every champion falls...no one can go on playing year after year at the same level..and it good that Fed has been doing it all this while and its just that now he's not doing well..its normal and I don't see him coming out of nowhere and doing what he was doing for the past 4 years...
Yes about Lendl...he did improve his serve but never went on to win in wimby...but I was stressing on net play...Fed is very good with his serve and stuff but to improve his net game I think he's on the wrong side of  twenty.
net game is something instinctive and natural.players should be born to have that touch......it can only be tuned with the given ability, but can't be improved in abundance and taken to a whole new level even if one strives for 30 hours a day on the practice courts......people would definitely try SNV if they have the skill.they will fall in love with SNV if they practice the inherent art......remember what pete said, "I would be SNVing till I die"......it often amazes me how blessed the 90s were with that many natural SNVers.......
Marian Vajda to Novak Djokovic, "I saw you beat that man like I never saw no man get beat before, and the man KEPT COMING AFTER YOU! Now we don't need no man like that in our lives."

i demand french open to be renamed RAFAEL GARROS

Offline falcon

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Re: Hose Higueras' impact
« Reply #96 on: June 15, 2008, 08:37:50 PM »
people would definitely try SNV if they have the skill.they will fall in love with SNV if they practice the inherent art......remember what pete said, "I would be SNVing till I die"......it often amazes me how blessed the 90s were with that many natural SNVers.......
[/quote]

very true


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Re: Hose Higueras' impact
« Reply #97 on: June 16, 2008, 05:18:42 PM »
people would definitely try SNV if they have the skill.they will fall in love with SNV if they practice the inherent art......remember what pete said, "I would be SNVing till I die"......it often amazes me how blessed the 90s were with that many natural SNVers.......

very true
[/quote]

wrong. if SNV were of any use, current pros who are all day looking for advantages to get money and points... they would adopt SNV. it is practically a market rule.

if the tactic was used in the 90s and died, is because it was of no longer use. new racquets, strings and slowed courts cause its disappearance.

Offline Swish

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Re: Hose Higueras' impact
« Reply #98 on: June 16, 2008, 06:59:06 PM »
people would definitely try SNV if they have the skill.they will fall in love with SNV if they practice the inherent art......remember what pete said, "I would be SNVing till I die"......it often amazes me how blessed the 90s were with that many natural SNVers.......

very true

Quote
wrong. if SNV were of any use, current pros who are all day looking for advantages to get money and points... they would adopt SNV. it is practically a market rule.

if the tactic was used in the 90s and died, is because it was of no longer use. new racquets, strings and slowed courts cause its disappearance.


I think you got a good point Batman, people will go were there is something to gain and apparently due to the playing equipment and conditions S&V doesn't offer as much or any advantage as a main skill in todays game.
« Last Edit: June 16, 2008, 07:12:33 PM by swish »

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Re: Hose Higueras' impact
« Reply #99 on: June 16, 2008, 07:27:27 PM »
Well even though I have the Roger/Pete Wimbledon match on tape, I'm also watching it on the Tennis Channel now and I'd' forgotten how often BOTH men came into the net.  S&V is OK, but this style is kind of boring to me.  I guess I've lived through the S&V days where all you got was ace, or service winner, and volley.  3 or 4 shots at most.  No rhythm or anything!  I would hate to see this style come back and maybe have someone like Ivo able to win at Wimbledon!  But I do agree that the courts today are too slow.  I wish they could reach an agreement to speed up the courts that's suppose to be fast and keep the clay slow, but not too fast like lightening!  I guess that's why I favor hardcourts more (like the old rebound ace and US Open courts) because it's fast enough but not too fast where all you see are aces.